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Importance of Branding with Martin Boonzayer


In this episode, Larry invited Martin Boonzayer. They are in the Collective Genius mastermind group together. Martin Boonzayer is the founder and CEO of The Trusted Home Buyer, a residential redevelopment company.

Martin has been involved in buying and selling real estate for the past 12 years and has been an entrepreneur his whole life. He is also a part-time martial arts instructor and a 2-time Olympian (2000 & 2004) in the sport of Judo.


  • How he got into business
  • What his business is all about
  • His business model
  • On partnering and mentoring locals
  • What his team looks like
  • His operation process
  • On consistently mailing your list
  • Number of postcards they are mailing
  • Branded marketing versus unbranded marketing
  • Consistent marketing
  • On seller financing
  • Vacation rentals or short-term rentals
  • Advice to those who are just starting out in real estate


  • "We are delivering value to our clients by solving their problem."
  • "Real estate is a great way where you can help people and you can have a lot of fun and you can make a living all at the same time."
  • "It's not about how much you make but how much you keep."
  • "It takes work to find a deal.”



Larry: Welcome to the Brain Pick-A-Pro show live from Lake Wylie, South Carolina. I’m Larry Goins. Thank you, guys, so much for watching. I really, really appreciate it. As you know, this is the show where we interview experts, people who are movers, shakers. They might be underground movers and shakers. You might have heard of them, maybe you haven’t, but our guest today is a good friend of mine. I’ve known him for, I dunno, maybe four or five years, something like that. We’re in a Mastermind together, Collective Genius Mastermind. You’ve heard us talk about that before here, and I’m just really excited to have him on because this guy doesn’t know this but I’ve heard him say before, when he’s around people at Collective Genius, kinda like I feel the same way, is I feel like this guy right here in a roomful of big, you know, ballers, right? But I gotta tell you, man, this guy right here impresses me and I look up to him, I admire him, and I just think he’s just an awesome guy. He’s married, has four children, and he’s a two-time Olympian in the sport of judo, right? Please give a warm welcome to Martin Boonzayer. What’s going on, buddy?

Martin: Hey, Larry, good to see you. It’s an honor and privilege to be on your show and thanks for the kind words and I’m excited to chat with you today.

Larry: Awesome, man. I’m really excited you’re on and why don’t you just start out and tell our viewers and listeners a little bit about your business.

Martin: Okay, sure. Well, I got into the business about ten years ago right before – well, the market was already soft in 2008 but I bought my first five houses in August, and if you guys remember it’s in September that Lehman crashed and so I had a baptism by fire, so to speak, but really I think it’s one of the best gifts I was given in this business because it forced me to learn to be creative, to think out of the box, to find a way to help people and in a way the traditional market couldn’t and so that really difficult market, I learned a lot of things. I learned how to buy the trustee sales, I learned how to seller finance deals because buyers couldn’t get financing, I learned how to do lease options, I learned how to do a lot of really creative things to help my customers and that’s really the main thing that I love about real estate is just there’s so many great ways that you can help people and make a living, and, yeah, that was ten years ago and so the first few years, it was a tough road to hoe but over the years I’ve managed to start building somewhat of a team and – I shouldn’t say somewhat. It was somewhat of a team for a year but we’ve got a good team now and, really, we’re crystalizing our vision on where we’re taking our company and so it’s been an interesting ten years.

Larry: That’s great, man. That is great. Tell us a little bit about what is your model? What are you doing and how has it evolved over the years?

Martin: Okay, so we do a lot of direct mail, direct-to-seller marketing to pick up properties, you know, under market value. We’re delivering value to our client by solving their problem whether, you know, whatever that problem might be so that’s our acquisition, and then we keep someone’s rentals, so over the years we’ve managed to build a pretty good rental portfolio that the purpose there is to, you know, provide the cushion so the next downturn, we’ll have that cash flow that’ll keep funding the company. We’re now expanding into vacation rentals which we’re excited about. Done quite a bit of wholesaling over the years but lately we are really focusing on fixing and flipping and keeping the rentals and fixing and flipping the ones we don’t wanna keep, but through this whole process, we’ve built a really good band called The Trusted Homebuyer and that’s what we’re really excited about is, you know, my background is engineering, so I’m a systems and process kind of guy so we’re expanding our business to include partners in some different markets where we’re providing the brand, the marketing, the infrastructure and we’re partnering with them to – on the acquisition side and help them build wealth as well, and so that’s a direction we’re going the last couple of years that I’m excited about and so – but, through all of that, you know, our main core business is here in Phoenix doing all the things that I mentioned.

Larry: So, with your brand, The Trusted Homebuyer – that’s an awesome brand, by the way. I really, really like that. It really is. It’s really good, it’s very seller friendly, and I like that and you are moving toward a model where you’re gonna be looking for local people to partner with, with that brand where you handle kind of the backend or set up with their systems and processes and procedures ’cause you’re a processes guy, right?

Martin: Right.

Larry: So, you’re gonna do that and then have the local guy in the market, you’re gonna partner with them, right?

Martin: That’s correct, ’cause I’ve always admired educators like yourself. I love helping people, I love mentoring and, for me, I’m not so much the guy to stand up in front of a room and, you know, promote my product. That’s not really what my vision for who I am and what I wanna do, but I love helping people and I feel like this is a way that we can bring the two together, and so be much more selective but still be able to provide that help and that mentorship which is, you know, as you know, that’s really the satisfaction for being in the education business, right? Is finding those few people who really get it and really wanna learn, really wanna work and help them get to where they wanna go, that’s the same thing that I’m hoping to accomplish or, really, I’m accomplishing. We do have a good partner actually here in our own market here in Phoenix. He’s one of my sales guys. He’s crushing it and we’re in the early stages of that partner program, but I feel like there’s an opportunity there to provide a service and provide assistance and a little bit of a different way than some of the other education and models out there.

Larry: Good, good. Is it too early to tell our listeners, our viewers how that partner program works?

Martin: Yeah, it’s probably a bit too early. I’m not here on your show trying to, you know, recruit people or anything to that effect, I’m just kind of sharing where I’m at in the evolution of my business.

Larry: Sure.

Martin: If somebody wants to contact me, of course, I’d be happy to have a conversation, but, yeah, it’s probably a little bit too early. I’d like to have things a little bit more defined but, with that said, you know, the right person – I mean, that’s really what it’s for, right? It’s got to be the right fit both ways.

Larry: Sure. Tell us a little bit about what your team looks like.

Martin: Okay. Well, what’s really enabled me to do more fix and flips is I brought on just an awesome project manager. We couldn’t be doing the volume of fix and flips that we’re doing today without her. She is amazing and probably one of the hardest hires that I – at least to find ’cause I’ve gone through a number of project managers but she’s – actually, we’re having – as I was telling you earlier before the show started, we’re having our best year ever and a lot of it is because of her and the volume of fix and flips. She’s just – she’s really good at what she does and so I think what helped me hire her is part of it is just being willing to expand my own envelope or billfold and pay more and get –

Larry: Quality.

Martin: Better installment and that’s just been one of the best decisions I’ve ever made, and so, of course, we have some sales people that help with the phones and run some appointments and then, really – that’s really it. We’re a pretty small team. We’re bringing on a full-time marketing person, that’s something we’ve been outsourcing, but we’re bringing on a full-time marketing person in the next few months which I’m excited about but what I’m really most excited about is we actually have a COO that’s gonna be our head of operations that’s gonna be starting next week. So, we’re really putting in the pieces in place right now to provide all the systems and support so that I can really be freed up to do the things that we were, you know, talking about like going out in the field and finding partners and helping them build their business and not just a wholesaling business but actually build wealth the way we are. That’s the whole objective is to build wealth in real estate that lasts for a lifetime.

Larry: That is great, that is great, and, you know, one of the big things that I really like what you’re talking about, you’ve mentioned this at least three times so far that you really like helping people, you really like helping people, and that’s whether it’s a seller, a buyer, or a local partner, or something like that, you really like helping people. I just think that’s awesome, man. It’s good. That is good. You gotta give back, right?

Martin: Yeah, and I appreciate you saying that ’cause I do really like helping people, but that’s why I feel so blessed is because real estate is a great way where you can help people and you can have a lot of fun and you can make a living, a good living, all at the same time.

Larry: Exactly.

Martin: And I’m sure there might be other formats but I think it’s one of the best formats that I’ve ever come across accomplishing all those things.

Larry: That’s awesome, yes, win-win. So, run us through, you’re doing direct mail, who are you mailing to? Absentee owners, probate? And then kind of what’s the flow? They call, what happens, you got a lead manager, you have sales people, you run appointments, you’re buying them over the phone.

Martin: Okay, so, well, for the list we mail to, I think it kinda depends on the market that you’re in, but, for us, we pay a data analytics service to put a list together for us. I think you’re familiar with them, I don’t know if you want me to mention the name over your podcast or not.

Larry: Well, I don’t care. I use them as well, I’ve mentioned them.

Martin: Oh, okay. Alright, so I use [inaudible 0:09:24]. I think they’re awesome. They do a way better job than I possibly could. I don’t have the time or the resources or the know-how, frankly, to combine – I think they take like 270 data points and they try to come up with the best – the people most likely to be in a position to sell and so I feel it’s worth the investment to buy that list and it’s one of the –

Larry: It’s very expensive, right?

Martin: It is, it is quite expensive but then so is mailing and mailing the wrong list can be expensive too.

Larry: Sure.

Martin: And I think that’s one of the mistakes though that sometimes people make when they get started in real estate is they make an investment in a list but then they don’t follow through and mailing it consistently. You have to mail that list once a month for at least six months, better a year. We still have leads coming in and I’m sure you do too that you’ve mailed sometimes people like, “Yeah, I’ve got your card and I’ve held on to it for the last three years and now I’m ready to sell,” you know? It happens. So, you build up that volume of kind of equity in your list over time too, but you can’t just mail the list once or twice, you do need to be consistent with it, so we mail consistently, you know, that phone call comes in, we try to answer it live whenever possible, I’m a big believer in the live answer just to be personable and warm when that person calls, but of course you can’t always take every call live so we have an answering service that captures the spill over, so once we get the information, I’m not sure how involved you wanna get but, yeah, we don’t buy over the phone like you do, I think that’s awesome that you do, but, in our business, we do go out on an appointment. We see the property and then negotiate with the seller on-site.

Larry: And I would like to say, in a market like you’re in, you just about have to go to the house because you’re in a highly competitive market.

Martin: Yeah, I think so. I think if I were to try to buy over the phone here in Phoenix, I don’t think I – I don’t know. I mean, I haven’t – my guess is what would happen is because people have so many investors to call that if somebody tries to buy over the phone and I get this feedback from sellers sometimes, like, “Well, this guy just wanted to lowball me over the phone,” and they just kinda throw that postcard away.

Larry: Right.

Martin: So I want to – and I also feel, for my brand, I need to have a marketing style and a system that’s consistent with our brand and so for me, or for us, The Trusted Homebuyer means going out, meeting people face to face whenever possible and, you know, furthering that relationship and that trust that we’re creating and, to your point, in Phoenix, I think other competitive markets as well, I think it would be hard to buy over the phone. I think buying over the phone works better in lesser populated areas.

Larry: You’re absolutely right. I totally agree with you. A lot of the people I mail to have never received a postcard before. I do like to have that.

Martin: That’s awesome, yeah. Literally, people will tell us and sometimes show us and they’ll say, “Yeah, I’ve got a stack of postcards like this.”

Larry: Right.

Martin: So, they measure it in feet, not inches.

Larry: How many postcards are you mailing a month?

Martin: You know, we really dialed back. We were mailing – in Phoenix, we were mailing twenty-five thousand and then in some of our other markets in Grand Rapids, we’re mailing twenty-five thousand, and then in Ohio, we were mailing another twenty-five thousand a month and that was just – that was when we were at our biggest, but we had scaled back a bit since then and now we’re working our way back up. So, in Phoenix, we’ve really niche down and we’re mailing less than five thousand postcards but we’re closing and flipping three to four of those a month.

Larry: Wait a minute, you’re mailing only five thousand postcards a month? Wow.

Martin: Yeah, yeah, but – and we’re gonna ramp that back up but we’ve, you know, like we’re talking about a little bit before, we’ve kind of reorganized our company and we’re growing again with the hires of the marketing and the COO that I was talking about, we’ll increase our volume again, but we’re really happy. We’re actually having, like I said, we’re having a great year with the three or four flips a month so that’s working really well for us.

Larry: Well, I responded that way not to give you a hard time but like, man, if you can mail five thousand postcards in Phoenix and get three to four deals a month, you’re doing fix and flip and you’re not talking about ten or twenty grand profit on a fix and flip, you gotta make a lot of money to do a fix and flip, so, man, I’m impressed.

Martin: Well, thanks. I mean, that’s why we’re having our best year because we’ve really – I think we are doing something really well. We’ve learned how to position our message and find the right people. There’s a lot of people that just wanted to have five, six investors come to their house and give them an offer and take the best deal.

Larry: Right.

Martin: And that’s fine. Well, we may run that appointment, but what we’re really looking for and what we’ve done a good job in finding is people that they want a predictable outcome, they’re willing to leave some money on the table just to do business with somebody they can really trust and feel good about, and we’ve learned how to, you know, hone that message and I’m sure we can hone it better when we continue to do that to attract those people and to provide the service that they’re looking for, so, ’cause we get that pretty routinely. We just bought a house couple of weeks ago, you know, just as an example because this happens pretty regularly. People tell us, “We really researched you online, we watched your videos, you know, we want to do business with you,” then we end up being the only person they talk to, they know that we are an investor, they know that we have to buy at a price to make it a profit but they want the service that we offer for some reason or another, and so that’s what we’ve gotten really good at, and I think now that we’ve kinda really figured that out, we can grow a little, I think, more effectively than the last time where it was a little bit more of a let’s just see how much we can mail and how much volume and – but, as you know, sometimes volume means spending a lot too.

Larry: That’s so true.

Martin: Like we’re saying before, it’s not how much you make, it’s how much you keep.

Larry: Yeah, that’s exactly right, that’s exactly right, and you gotta be able to balance that because if you get too many leads coming in, you can’t follow up with them and you’ll lose them and you’re paying too much for marketing, right?

Martin: Yep.

Larry: Is all your direct mail branded? I mean, a lot of people just mail out like, I buy houses, we buy houses, you know, sell your house fast, or are you marketing through your direct mail as branded as The Trusted Homebuyer?

Martin: Well, we do both, but we are moving in a direction and we haven’t eliminated unbranded marketing ’cause it does pull in a different seller sometimes but what we found, for our message and what we’re trying to create with our – the rapport, you know, that we’re trying to create with our client, we’re finding that even though we get about 50-50 leads on each type of marketing piece, we close a lot more deals than the branded side because it’s more consistent with what we’re trying to find. We feel like the people that are responding to the unbranded in our market, they tend to be more of the people that are like, “Oh, hey this guy might live next door. He might be dumb enough to overpay,” you know? So, that’s kind of a generalization but kind of my sense of what – so, we’re getting the unbranded people, they tend to be more of the ones that are wanting to trade a bidding war which we don’t wanna get into.

Larry: Right.

Martin: And the Trusted Homebuyer, the branded marketing, is attracting more of the type of people that we want, but with that said, we still close deals on the unbranded side. Sometimes, it’s just getting the postcard in the right hands at the right time and, you know, so, at the end of the day, it’s consistent marketing that’s really – and it’s not so much – I’m not a big believer like you have to have this perfect marketing piece, it has to have these certain keywords. Bottom line is just be respectful. Tell people you’re interested in buying their house and if they wanna sell, they’ll call you.

Larry: Right. I found that as well if you can’t help somebody, then refer them to somebody else or give them some tips or ideas that’s gonna actually help them. You know, hey if – I mean, I ask people up front, “What’s more important to you, a quick cash sale or getting the most amount of money?” Right?

Martin: Right.

Larry: And if they say get the most amount of money, I say, “Well, okay you probably don’t need to be selling to me. Here’s what you need to do,” right?

Martin: Yeah.

Larry: You know, get it in tiptop shape, list it with a realtor for six to twelve months, wait on an offer, hope they qualify for a loan, hope it appraises and passes inspection. By the time we tell them that, then it’s like, “Well, maybe I’ll just sell my house to you.”

Martin: And, you know, those leads too can sometimes be good seller finance deals.

Larry: Right.

Martin: You can give them that higher price if they’re willing to be creative on the terms and we’ll throw out too as far as branded and unbranded, it makes a difference in markets. In Phoenix here, that’s really what I was speaking too but in the – like I suspect we’re not really in any rural markets per se, but in the smaller markets, I think unbranded does better because, again, people aren’t so accustomed to receiving postcards. They’re not – they don’t look at ’em through the same jaded filter that somebody who’s been getting postcards, multiple postcards a week, perhaps for years, might be looking at it here in Phoenix. So, it kinda depends on the market too and so that’s part of the process that we go through is when mailing in a different market is testing it out. You’ve got to test it, you’ve gotta have different mail pieces, you always have to be improving and measuring what works ’cause what works in Florida may not work in Phoenix and it may not work the same in Dallas or California or whatever, but the bottom line is people need to sell houses, people are in distressed situations and we can help them, and it’s our job to figure out the best way to find those people.

Larry: That’s a really good point. You mentioned seller financing. When you can’t pay somebody’s cash price, you offer to give them their price if they’re willing to finance it. Tell us a little bit about that and maybe a deal or two you’ve done.

Martin: Yeah, so I wish I would do more of these. I love seller financing. You know Eddie Speed, he’s the king, and he has so many creative ways to do deals. I generally keep it fairly simple. I’d like to expand our repertoire, so to speak, but, for example, for me, ’cause like Eddie, he can teach you how to – and maybe you can too ’cause I think you’ve done a lot of these, structure a seller carry deal that you can flip the deal.

Larry: Right.

Martin: Just a little higher. I generally don’t. When we do a seller carry, I structure it pretty simple with a monthly payment that allows cash flow and then I can move it into a rental or a vacation rental.

Larry: Right.

Martin: And as long as I have cash flow, I don’t really care what the purchase price is because, I mean, think about it, houses thirty years ago, it didn’t matter if you bought it for $15,000 or $18,000 or $20,000 if it’s worth $120,000 today, you know? It doesn’t really matter. You could pay market value, above market value, you can pay double if they give you good enough terms and that’s what I like about seller financing. So, we’ve done that a few times where if somebody is stuck on a number, in fact, I’m negotiating one right now in a great area in Phoenix, beautiful area. They want their number. It’s about a hundred grand more than it’s worth but if I can get them to get me a monthly payment that allow me to cash flow it as a vacation rental, I’m gonna do that deal. Now, I do need to put about eighty grand into it so what we’re talking about, this is a little bit creative, where we are going to delay the monthly payment. We’re gonna do two loans. We’re gonna do a loan for a smaller amount like a hundred grand. Instead of as a down payment, I’m gonna repay that hundred grand in two years and then the monthly payment for the balance is gonna kick in and so that’s gonna allow me to get into that deal for a lot less money out of my pocket while I’m renovating and the larger monthly payment will kick in a little bit down the road.

Larry: And you know what, any seller should love that because if you’re putting eighty grand into their house, you know, all you’re doing is increasing the equity in their asset that they have a loan.

Martin: Yeah.

Larry: Exactly, exactly. That’s really good. Now, you’ve mentioned a couple of times vacation rentals or short-term rentals. Let’s talk a little bit about that. Tell us – I’m assuming you’re doing a lot of Airbnb.

Martin: Yeah. Well, it is a pretty new business for us, but, I mean, we live in Phoenix, right? So, people come here for all sorts of reasons but spring training is a big one, the Phoenix Open is a big one, you know, the Barrett-Jackson Car Show, I mean, the Phoenix Cardinals. You know, anyway, there’s some people who travel in for professional sports games. It’s a big – not as big as let’s say Vegas for conventions but people come in for – anyway, bottom line is even in the summer when it’s hot, people are traveling and this is a great destination spot and like I said, it’s something we’re just getting started in but we’re really excited about because we feel like – on average, we should be able to about double our net monthly on a property as a vacation rental versus a traditional rental, and the other beauty of a vacation rental is your property is getting cleaned every three, four days versus a rental where after you – when you see it a year or two later, it definitely hasn’t been cleaned every three or four days.

Larry: Probably never.

Martin: Probably never, right.

Larry: That’s funny. I love it.

Martin: Like, we got this house in Tempe where it’s like a five-bedroom house. It’s not a particularly special house but it’s a good area and we’ve had it rented for a couple of months at a time for a company that has a temporary construction crew, so they’ll rent it for like two months at a time which is great for us. We’ve also had it rented, you know, to like a wedding party. People come in and like fifteen people can stay in that house so they pay a premium, it’s $500, $600 a night, but for them it’s still a great deal because they got fifteen people in there versus going to a hotel.

Larry: Right.

Martin: And so it seems to be a really great niche that we’re excited about expanding.

Larry: Are you managing them yourself in-house? Or how are you – you have one person you put on that, you know, handling everything and, you know, following up with the tenant to make sure, are you happy, you know, is there enough food in the basket and all that stuff.

Martin: Yeah, we have a lady that handles that and then we have – and she makes sure that we’ve got the cleaning crew that, you know, comes in and can do the turn and all that type of thing and so it’s this whole other set of issues, but, yeah, we do handle it in-house and that’s what I think we’re pretty good at. Again, that kind of goes back to the whole processes and systems type of thing that I actually like setting up. I don’t like running them but I like setting them up. That’s why I hire people to run them.

Larry: That’s good, that’s good. So, if you have to give some advice to somebody just starting out in real estate. I mean, we have a lot of people listening to this podcast, whether they’re brand new, never done a deal, or very experienced, so, somebody just start now, what kind of advice would you give them? I mean, you started ten years ago right before the market crashed, right? And look at you now, man. I mean, you’ve got a brand, you’ve got employees, you just hired a COO, you just hired a marketing person that’s starting next week, you’ve got a team built up, you’re going into different markets, you’re looking for partners. Man, you are – I mean, you’re very, very successful. So, what kind of advice would you give to people just starting out?

Martin: Well, I think for me – I think the reason we’ve had the success we’ve had is the same reason I think I’ve had some success in judo, in sports, it’s just quitting is not an option, just show up, you know? I remember thinking a lot of times, it’s half the battle, about 90 percent of the battle, but just show up. You know, so when I was training, I did not want to go train every day. I didn’t wanna go train three times a day whenever – but even when I didn’t wanna do it, I managed to get through the door and then, you know, the motivation kicked in and I think in the business world, it’s the same thing, just show up and what showing up means here is do the things you gotta do, send your direct mail, answer the phone, don’t quit, and you’re gonna get better. If you’re gonna get discouraged if you don’t get a certain result within, you know, a few weeks or a few months or maybe even – you know, then this may not be the business for you ’cause this can be – as you know, yeah, it sounds great when you’re in a podcast and you list out all the successes, you and I both know it is a ton of work and you go through – you take your lumps. Every real estate investor has lost money, sometimes a lot of money on some different deals. There’s a lot of challenges here. There’s a lot of payoff but there’s a lot of challenges and you gotta have to – just gotta want it, just can’t let an obstacle turn you aside. Just have to –

Larry: I love that, that is great, great advice. It really is good advice. You’ve got to just show up, you gotta keep pushing, you gotta keep pushing, and you gotta put in the short-term pain for the long-term gain, right?

Martin: Yeah.

Larry: I’ve got a young guy on my team, Angel. He’s twenty-three years old and this kid, every day, when I come in the office about 8:30, he’s already here, he’s listening to Grant Cardone, he’s watching videos, listening to Jim Rohn, he’s walking around the office reading a book out loud to himself and this kid is motivated, right? And he’s been to a couple of my seminars that’s why I met him, but he does acquisitions and he told me yesterday, he said, Larry – he was out putting out signs. He was out putting out signs for a property that we had for sale and he’s getting out of the car and people are looking at him and, you know, what the heck are you doing over here and he’s out there putting a sign in the ground and stuff and he said, you know, Larry, it got me thinking. He said everybody talks about real estate is all glamorous and exciting and make a lot of money and the checks start rolling in, he said, but when you’re out here on the street and you’re getting out of the car, putting out a sign on the corner, it’s work, man, it’s work and you gotta put forth the effort. You gotta put forth the effort before the money starts coming in. He said people don’t realize that it’s work and you gotta get out there and get people that, you know, are giving you the mean look or whatever, put down a sign in front of their convenience store or whatever or, you know, hoping nobody sees you, you don’t get run over or going out to look at houses and it’s full of roaches and, you know, bed bugs and all that stuff and you’re taking pictures at houses, it’s nasty work sometimes but you get paid for it. You get paid for doing stuff other people don’t wanna do, right?

Martin: That’s right and, yeah, and I think the common misconception that I would speak to for people considering real estate is I think a lot of people they envision themselves, “Oh, I would be good at this because I can see the vision on how to make a property look nice, I can do a flip, I watched that show,” you know? The reality is we are not in the real estate business. If you wanna make money in this business, you are in the marketing business.

Larry: Right.

Martin: That is where the money is made. You make money in finding the opportunities. If you find an opportunity, anybody can take an ugly house, write a check, and have somebody make it look good and make a profit. Now, granted, how much profit you make might vary a bit depending on, you know, your choice of contract or how you manage your flip, but that’s – it’s not hard to make an ugly house look good. What’s hard is paying your dues, doing the work to find a way to help the people that really need it, finding those opportunities, finding those deals, that’s the hard work in this business and it involves getting in sometimes some messy situations, whether it’s in the signs, walking through ugly houses, sometimes dealing with, you know, grouchy or angry people because they’re so beat down by whatever life has thrown at them, but that’s the opportunity we have too is we have an opportunity to make a difference for them, help them solve their problem, but you’ve got to work to find that person. Most people – nobody is gonna just hand you a deal and that’s kinda, you know, whether – you can find a deal on a multiple listing service, but like, in our market, it’s few and far between, and it still takes a lot of work ’cause now you’re combing through thousands of listings. Bottom line is it takes work to find the deal. That’s really where the persistence really pays off is the marketing and then the real estate is just the vehicle.

Larry: That’s true. I’ve often said that, you know, we could be selling boats or cars or vacuum cleaners or whatever. It’s just all what you’re marketing for, right?

Martin: Right.

Larry: That’s good. Man, this has been some really, really good stuff. I really appreciate you sharing openly and freely about your business and what you’re doing. If somebody wanted to reach out to you, I mean, I know you’re a busy guy, right? You got a lot on your plate, but if somebody may have an interest in, you know, in your brand or, you know, being a local partner or like to reach out to you, how will they do that?

Martin: Well, they can go to my website,, and again don’t forget the “the” in front, so, and there’s a Contact Us form they can fill out. I would like to say if somebody is interested and talk to me further that before we get on the phone that they spend thirty minutes on my website and watch the webinar that we put together on what we do and how we operate and who we are, that’ll give a really good idea of the type of business that we operate and who we are as a company and I would ask somebody to check that out before they – I shouldn’t say necessarily before but reach out to us anytime but I would like to ask you to watch that webinar as a precursor to spending sometime on the phone just so that we have some commonalities and things to talk about at that point.

Larry: That’s good, so they’ve got a little bit of education about what you’re trying to do.

Martin: Yeah.

Larry: Good, good. Well, man, thank you so much for taking the time today. I know you’re very, very busy. You got a lot going on and I really appreciate you sharing your words of wisdom today.

Martin: Okay. It’s my pleasure, Larry. I really appreciate the opportunity to be on this show with you and, like I said before, I’ve admired you for a long time, and, actually, I didn’t say this in the show but I should. You’re one of the first people in real estate when I got involved, I don’t know if I bought your course or not, but I remember watching a webinar with you before I even got into the business and so when I first met you at our Mastermind, I was like, “That’s Larry Goins, you’re kidding. Wow, I know that guy.” And so it’s been an incredible privilege and honor to go from watching you on a webinar to actually being on a podcast with you and, so, thank you.

Larry: Cool, man. I appreciate it. Thank you so much for that. I really appreciate that and thanks for all your words of wisdom that you shared and you are making a difference on a lot of people’s lives and I sincerely appreciate that. There’s not near as many people out there doing what we do that are actually helping people, right? Creating win-win situations.

Martin: Right.

Larry: And I really appreciate what you’re doing and that’s important.

Martin: Awesome. Thank you so much, Larry.

Larry: Alright. Thanks a lot, buddy. I appreciate it. Take care.