Join us for this episode of Larry Goins Brain-Pick-A-Pro. Learn from leading experts in real estate investing and business. Get the latest information of what is working right now and their predictions for the future. Get ahead of the pack and take advantage of this insider information. Success leaves clues! See first hand what works from them, the lessons they have learned and how to avoid the mistakes they have made. Don’t miss a single episode of Larry Goins Brain-Pick-A-Pro.

Ready To Take Your Real Estate Investing To The Next Level? Click Here to Apply To Work Personally With Larry and His Team!

  • Or Listen To Our Podcast:

Lease Options Cash Flow with Joe Lieber

SHOW SUMMARY:

Larry sat down with a fellow investor and mastermind member—Joe Lieber. Joe is the broker/president of Real Estate Quest. Joe began investing in real estate in 1998.

Since then, he has bought and sold more than 700 houses. Over the years, he has also been involved in many aspects of real estate from the brokerage side, to management, rehabs, landlording, wholesaling, and multi-family.

In this episode, Joe shared how he achieved his freedom number through cheap houses, his different models, and so much more!

SHOW HIGHLIGHTS:

  • Who Joe Lieber is
  • His real estate investing business
  • His main objective
  • Hitting his freedom number
  • Cheap houses in Cleveland
  • His 2 models
  • How he determines what to rent out to section 8 versus rent to own
  • Rundown of a typical rent to own deal
  • Their option consideration
  • The type of yield his turnkey buyer is getting
  • Financing the deal
  • Selling notes
  • Finding turnkey buyers and note buyers
  • Property management
  • Finding investors all over the country and around the world
  • Setting up and structuring foreign investors buying property
  • His losses
  • What section 8 is

Quotes:

  • "If it was easy, everybody would be doing that."
  • "Keeping some, selling some."
  • "Don't be just an educator. Be a student as well.”

RESOURCES AND LINKS FROM THIS SHOW:

  • RE/MAX
  • Contact information:
  • Email Address: rebroker216@gmail.com
  • Phone number: 440-387-4800 ext. 2

SHOW TRANSCRIPT:

Larry: Welcome to the Brain-Pick-A-Pro show live from Lake Wylie, South Carolina and all the way up north in Cleveland, Ohio, fellow mastermind member, fellow investor, friend, entrepreneurial mogul himself, Joe Lieber. What’s going on, buddy?

Joe: How are you doing, buddy? Thanks for having me on.

Larry: Man, I’m good. Thanks for being on today. We were just talking before we started recording, man, I’ve been running around like crazy today. Just before we recorded this, I literally got off a live webinar 2 minutes before I dialed you up.

Joe: Oh my goodness.

Larry: I know, right? Man, I’m really excited to have you on here. I’ve seen you on the calendar for a while coming up and I’m really excited that you’re on today because you got a lot of cool stuff to share and you’ve been doing a lot of different business. I mean, I could sit here and read your bio and all that but why don’t you share with our listeners a little bit about yourself. Who is Joe Lieber?

Joe: Alright, Larry. Thanks for having me on once again. I’m super excited to be here. I am from Cleveland, Ohio and I have been investing in real estate since 1998. Larry, I have been involved in almost every aspect of this business from landlording to wholesaling, to rehabbing. I have a full service real estate brokerage, wholesaling, and now, I’m currently doing turnkey property for people all over the world. They’re saying the hottest real estates in the country right now. Everybody wants to know what Lebron is going to do here in a minute, answering questions. Here we are though. It’s been a wild crazy ride and hopefully today some of your listeners, I can give them the keys to the elevator because over the last 20 plus years, I’ve taken the stairs and it has been a long way up. Hopefully I can drop some good nuggets today and people get a lot out of today’s episode.

Larry: You’ve been doing this for a long time. I mean, you’ve started like the late 90s.

Joe: Yes, sir. Late 90s. 1998, really started getting into the business so it’s been a crazy ride.

Larry: That’s really good, man. That’s really good. Let’s talk about the real estate side. I mean, you’ve got the investment company. I mean, you own a lot of properties. I mean a lot of properties, right? But you also have the brokerage. So, tell us a little bit about your real estate investing business.

Joe: Here is really what it boils down to, for me in being a real estate investor, I always want to find that freedom number. People talk about that all the time. How much money do you need to come in passively so you really don’t have to work? You get to do what you want to do, all day every day. My main objective in my real estate business was to get as quickly as possible to my freedom number. That number is always ever changing because once we hit our freedom number, usually we want to go up and beyond, I want to get that. I want that BMW, or whatever the case is; but it gets fun and exciting at that point. So, I hit my freedom number a long time ago. I did it through cheap houses here in Cleveland, Ohio and that’s what works really well for me. It’s a great model. I’m here to educate about that and talk about that today.

Larry: That’s awesome. So tell us a little bit about the cheap houses in Cleveland. Tell us about your model.

Joe: You know, I do two things here. I invest in single family homes. That’s where I found the best phase for me. I’ve owned multifamily. I actually owned a 48-unit building for 10 years. I just sold it in January 17. Actually that was good for me. I’m glad to sell it.

Larry: I hope you turned 31 it.

Joe: Well, I lost money out of that actually after 10 years of ownership.

Larry: Wow.

Joe: Yeah, pretty wild. I bought it in 2009 and one of the very slow real estate market and I still lost money on this deal 10 years later. So, I quickly learned that, you know, multifamily just wasn’t for me. Single family home, that niche there, the tenant retention, the taxes advances, the cash flow, all those things is what I felt was just win-win-win. That’s the right shine. So then the next draw to Cleveland is the houses are cheap. In a lot of the parts of the country, you can buy a house for an earnest money deposit. Literally, these houses came running probably from $40,000 to $75,000, or $80,000. Those were earnest money deposits in a lot of markets. It’s really interesting to a lot of people. So I do two things here, really. I do single family homes that I put on Section 8, and that’s a whole thing we can talk about. Then I also do single family homes that I do on rent to own. I give these, I call it the average American family, a chance at home ownership. I put people on these properties with the opportunity to enjoy the homes, to kind of test drive the home a little bit, make sure that they like being there, it works for them, and like the neighborhoods and then I give them the opportunity to buy these homes at a little later date. It’s advantageous on both ends. I really have two models in the single family market and that’s the rent to own and the Section 8.

Larry: I love that, man. That’s really good. They rent to own. You kind of give them a trial period. I call those people homeowners in training. That’s what I call them.

Joe: Yeah. It’s great.

Larry: So tell us a little bit about those two different models. How do you determine which property are you going to rent out Section 8 versus you’re going to rent to own? And then we’ll get into a little more structure.

Joe: Yeah. Basically, I identify what the neighborhood is going to call for. If the neighborhood is predominantly Section 8 rentals and there’s a lot of that in the neighborhood, I’m going to do that there. Versus, you know, a different type of neighborhood maybe a B-class type neighborhood where you’re going to find a lot of owners. Typically, I’m going to want to do a rent to own there because someone has the interest of wanting to own that home and continue to build a clean, nice neighborhoods.

Larry: Right. That’s awesome. Give us a typical rundown of a typical rent-to-own deal. What you’re buying it for? How you fund it? How much they’re paying? How much down? All that good stuff.

Joe: Absolutely. So a typical rent-to-own right now on the west side of Cleveland, so let me say this too, Cleveland, Ohio is a very segregated market. It’s funny. I mean, any Clevelander, anywhere in the country, and if they say they’re from Cleveland, you always ask are you an east-sider or west-sider?

Larry: Oh really?

Joe: It really is. It’s that crazy. It seems like people from the east side stick on the east side and the west siders stay on the west side. Everybody will always say, I’m not going for the east side, I don’t like it over there. And then the westsider would say, you know, it’s very funny how that works. So I’m a westside so I do everything on the westside of Cleveland. That’s where I shine. That’s where I know. That’s what I love. It’s what works.

Here’s what the homes are going to look like. It’s typically a 3:1 colonial or bungalow built sometime between 1920 and 1950 and they usually have some CapEx one to them. CapEx or major repair or major items like roofs, windows, siding, gutters, furnaces, ACs, hot water tanks. We usually hit on a lot of that CapEx and it will be a good rent to own property. Then what we’ll do is we kind of leave a few things that are undone like we might paint the first floor and not pain the upstairs. So we kind of do that deliberately because what I’m trying to create is the perfect marriage. I need them invested in these homes. So I’ll get a little bit of money down, and a little bit of sweat equity and when I put those two things together, it’s a perfect marriage.

Larry: I love it.

Joe: They pay really well and it works great. As far as the numbers of a home like that, I would call that pretty much a turnkey asset and that’s going to run to about $75,000.

Larry: You’re going to be in it for 75.

Joe: All in it for $75,000, like I would sell that to my investors for.

Larry: Oh, you would sell it. Okay, so you turn those actually, you put your lease option or Section 8 person it and then you sell it to a turnkey buyer.

Joe: Yes. I will sell it to a turnkey buyer for about $75,000. The rents are around 800 to 850 a month, and the beauty of it is the tenant is responsible for all repairs to the property. So you’re not going to get those typical maintenance calls because that’s the contract that they enter into with me, that they’re responsible to home ownership and training like we talked about.

Larry: Right. Are you doing that on a lease option or land contract or how do you structure it?

Joe: I’m doing a lease option.

Larry: Okay good.

Joe: Five year lease with an option to buy.

Larry: Five year. That’s great.

Joe: Five years. Yeah. Everyone signs a five year lease. You know, Larry, we’ve been around the business a long time, and you and I both know that this is a Class C property and I wish everybody will buy these homes. Unfortunately, just a small percentage that actually end up exercising their option to buy the home after five years. These folks typically, things changed, they’d either have another child or they need more space or kids are moving out of the house and they want to downsize, or it could be anything, a divorce happened, or anything. It’s a very small percentage of people that actually buy the homes; but nevertheless, I just like to say I’m leading the people to the opportunity for homeownership whether or not they take it or not is up to them.

Larry: Right. You and I both know the vast majority never close.

Joe: Exactly.

Larry: That’s just the way it is.

Joe: Yeah.

Larry: What type of a strike price or option price do you give them if your turnkeying that for 75, what’s their price? Probably in the 80s or 90s, right?

Joe: Exactly. It’s in the right deal. Sometimes I leave it open-ended because the real estate market is going up here, like really going up. It’s crazy. I put a praise value on the contract a lot of the time. In that way, at the end of the lease we get an appraisal done, if they’re really going to buy it and then we kind of negotiate with them from there a little bit. I leave it a little bit open-ended for the tenant because we’ve seen tenants come in in and finish basements, and we’ve seen tenants put roofs on and things of that nature. I try to tell tenants I’m not trying to have you do all the work and then me rip the benefits on the backend. So what I kind of tell them, you’re going to be right about that $90,000 price point unless the market goes through the roof or something crazy.

Larry: Right. Right. That makes sense. On an $80,000 or $90,000 house like that and if they’re paying 800 to 850 a month, what is typically their downpayment, their option consideration?

Joe: Between 1,500 and 2,500.

Larry: Oh wow. Okay.


Joe: Now that varies because during tax time, you usually can get 3 grand or maybe 4 grand. Once you get passed about June of July, you’re back down to 1,500 to 2 grand typically.

Larry: Now you probably keep that money yourself. You don’t pass that along to your turnkey buyer, do you?

Joe: I do. I pass it right on to my turnkey buyers.

Larry: Really? That’s great.

Joe: Yeah. I hope they enjoy that.

Larry: It helps bump their yield up. So what type of yield is your turnkey buyer getting on these kind of deals?

Joe: They’re seeing 10%.

Larry: Okay. Is that including their tax benefits or just 10% cash on cash?

Joe: Cash on cash is 10%. No tax benefits. I’m not even including that initial downpayment that I give to them. That’s not even included. If you include that and the tax benefits, you’re getting upwards to 15. You know.

Larry: Yeah that’s good. That’s really good. Now, are most of your turnkey buyers, are they financing the deal or they’re paying cash for the whole 75?

Joe: You know that’s a great question, Larry. So we see a lot of cash but lately over the last year, I have been personally financing the buyers. And I have been off from a really simple loan that everybody loves and it’s a loan that I actually used myself to build my 150 houses that I own now. I do 50% down and then 50% loan by Uncle Joe, as I like to say, at a five year amortization at 10% interest.

Larry: Five year am at 10% and so on the 75, you’re financing 37,500 or they put 37,500 down and then 10%, is it interest-only payments?

Joe: No. It’s a full amortization. So in five years, it’s paid for completely.

Larry: That’s awesome, man. I love that. The 50-50 model.

Joe: The 50-50 model. You pay for half, the tenant pays for half.

Larry: That’s great, man. I love that. The goal should be, and I hope you don’t mind me saying this, but the goal should be, you’re getting most of all your money upfront in the downpayment in the 50% down.

Joe: I wish I was, but the market is really getting up here so much that no, I’m not getting a whole on that 50% down. That would be a good goal and about four years ago, I could do that. Anymore, no. What I’m actually doing is taking that paper and selling them on a secondary market so I can get cashed out.

Larry: Wow, okay.

Joe: Keeping some, selling some. I should say. About half the time, I keep it; half the time, I sell it.

Larry: Now you’re getting me excited. I want to buy some of that paper, because that’s good. I mean you’re at 50% loan to value. You’ve rehabbed the house. You got a lease option tenant in there. You got an investor that is buying the deal, so you’ve got the investor on the hook. You got the homeowner in training on the hook, right? They put 50% down, they’re not getting much cash flow right now. All the money is going to pay you, Uncle Joe, right? So you’re getting the same amount as just about as the rent coming to you.

Joe: As owning the house.

Larry: Yeah, as owning the house. So tell us about selling that note? What do you get for those notes? What kind of yields do you sell them out?

Joe: Well I have been getting them, the first couple I sold, I was getting at 100% LTV.

Larry: Wow.

Joe: Then I drop the 97, and right now my note buyers are buying them at 90.

Larry: At 90?


Joe: At 90. I won’t really go much more lower than that with this particular note buyer. If they take me lower than 90, I’m just going to start selling to, I call them my rich friends, you know I got friends up here that are doctors and businessmen, I’ll just say, hey I’ve got a piece of paper I can sell you at 10% yield by a high net worth investor because most of these investors are high net worth people, right?

Larry: Right.

Joe: The default ratio is almost zero after putting 50% down and being that they’re usually high net worth people, I can sell those notes for a damn near 100% of the face value of them.

Larry: Wow. Okay, so if you loan 37,500, 10% at five years, that’s a $796 payment.

Joe: Is it? I don’t even know, Larry. If that’s what it is, okay. Five year term, 10%. Yeah, you’re right. 796, yeah.

Larry: So, and then you discount that down. You’re probably selling at what 35,000 or something. You discount it a little bit. Not much.

Joe: Yeah, that’s fair. Yeah, discount a little bit. 95% something like that. Okay.

Larry: Yeah, so if you discount it down, the yield is going to be… that yield bumps up to 1302, right?

Joe: Yeah, just like that.

Larry: Man, that’s sweet. 50% loan to value at 13% yield. Man, I want some of those.

Joe: That’s fair. Everybody wants those. I’m trying to keep as many as I can, but I can’t keep them all.

Larry: I hear you. So, tell us a little bit about finding turnkey buyers and then finding note buyers. Are they all in the same pool? Do you have some turnkey buyers that… they’re probably two different people, I would assume.

Joe: Yeah, they really are two different people.

Larry: Yeah. Tell us about that.

Joe: People that want to buy real estate want to buy real estate and that's their goal.

Larry: Right.

Joe: ...because there's a lot of benefits to actually owning the property too. As a note buyer, personalized paper, you don't get the tax benefits that you would with owning real estate which is a big thing. So, it's really two different people. But as far as the turnkey buyers are concerned, they come from all over the world. I mean, not just California and Arizona, not just those major markets. I have clients in London, Australia, Rio de Janeiro Brazil, Vancouver, Tokyo, and just like all over the world is crazy that people are coming into Cleveland, Ohio.

Larry: That is sweet. That is sweet. That is sweet. So I'm assuming that you manage the properties for them. There's not a whole lot of management. It's really kind of hands off, but I'm assuming you manage it for them.

Joe: It is. I don't manage actually. I've got a 150 of my own assets to deal with every day. I mean look, it's work. I mean it's not just, I'm dancing over here, Larry, and counting money. I mean, yes, you're going to count money but you're going to work a little bit too. So, what I do with my folks is, I have a strategic relationship with a RE/MAX real estate franchise here and this RE/MAX franchise is the best. These guys, I have it dialed in, I've sent all my clients to RE/MAX. Believe it or not, I have not had one complaint yet from one of my clients that I've sent to RE/MAX for property management.

Larry: Wow.

Joe: I know. It's crazy. It's been a good relationship.

Larry: So, where are you finding all of these investors from all over the country and around the world, in London and all these places?

Joe: A lot of them come from podcasting. You know, I do podcast to other CG members who have big podcast and I get a lot of calls from there. A lot of referral business. I get a lot of that. And I've also joined international real estate associations as an adviser.

Larry: That's sweet.

Joe: ...and that will come through that as well.

Larry: That's great, man. You know, just like this podcast you're doing right now. Somebody might watch it and reach out to you and say, hey I want to buy one of those notes Larry is excited about.

Joe: Yes. Exactly.

Larry: That's awesome, man. I love it. I love it. So, tell us how, and this is something that I haven't really worked with in the past. I've done about every kind of real estate there is just about, but one thing I haven't really worked with a lot is foreign investors. How do you set up and structure someone from the UK buying property in the states from you?

Joe: So what I do is I have them get a State of Ohio limited liability company, an LLC, here and a US bank account. It's the easiest way to make things work. I hook them up with an attorney here as well to advise them on things they may need and really it's a pretty smooth simple transaction because they cannot procure traditional financing here in the US so it's either all cash or bank of uncle Joe here. So it is really pretty smooth. I have a great relationship with everybody to this day and I'm always here to help them through things and things like that.

Larry: That's awesome, man. That's really good. That is really good. So, your rent to own buyers, they put about $1,500 to $2,500 down.

Joe: Yup.

Larry: You give five year option, right?

Joe: Correct.

Larry: Good, and then you send them over to RE/MAX property manager, local there, that you got a good relationship with.

Joe: That's it.

Larry: Man, that's sweet.

Joe: It's that easy.

Larry: I love that. Well, listen. You say it's easy but if it was easy, everybody would be doing it, right?

Joe: Everybody will do it. Exactly.

Larry: It's not easy, but it sounds like you have simplified it.

Joe: It's like losing weight, Larry. All you’ve got to do is work out and eat good.

Larry: I know right. That's all you’ve got to do, right?

Joe: That's all you got to do.

Larry: That's what I say, you know, real estate is not easy, neither is life. If life were easy, we'd all be skinny, happy, and rich.

Joe: You got it.

Larry: That's for sure. That's for sure. So, man, let me ask you a question. Do you do the same thing for finding your note buyers as you do for finding your turnkey buyers doing podcast like this and joining groups and stuff like that?

Joe: You know, I haven't had to look that hard for note buyers. You know, I've only originated probably 50 notes in the last two years. Not anything too crazy, a lot of cash people. The note buyers have just come organically really. Other collective genius members have approached me with buying some of this paper and just my local network of rich friends, as I call them, they're always interested in buying that kind of paper. So, I haven't really had enough. I have more buyers for notes than I have actual notes to sell.

Larry: Right. Right. Now, what about on your side, the funding of your deals, like when you take down this property that you ultimately sell for 75, are you using private money or are you using Joe's bank?

Joe: At this point, I've been using Joe's bank. I have raised a little bit of money from my local network of friends and it has been very simple. It's always been in a handshake and it’s the same terms. It's 8% interest only.

Larry: Alright. There you go.

Joe: That's just a great deal, you know?

Larry: It is a great deal.

Joe: I'm happy with that. I never have to worry about getting mortgages together and filing them at court, and all that stuff... because you know, I'm very credible and the people here especially know that. People in my network. So it's just super easy to get money for me.

Larry: That's really good, man.

Joe: But I haven't raised that much, Larry. It's only been half a million or so.

Larry: That's really good. You mentioned something earlier that I want to touch on. I mean, you know, you'll never know who's going to watch a podcast. You know there's a lot of newbies out there that have never done a deal and there's also experienced investors. I get on podcast and watch them. I was watching one earlier today.

Joe: Sure.

Larry: So I'm a firm believer of don't just be an educator, be a student as well. I'm a student as well. You mentioned something earlier about your 48-unit that you lost money on it. I've told people for years, if you do enough real estate, you will lose money. I think the most amount of money I've ever lost on a deal, I bought a Shoney's restaurant one time. I had it for about two years. I can't remember how much I paid for it. It was like two or three million dollars or something. Shoney's was my tenant. Just before I had it under contract to sell, I was going to make about 150,000 on it which wasn't a lot but it was still okay. The week before we got ready to close, I got a letter from a professional corporate lease negotiator, right? ...telling me that Shoney's is going to have to renegotiate their lease and lower their payments because they're in financial distress. So, my buyer ended up following through but he cut my price about $225,000 which not only lost my 150 gain, but cost me another 75,000, right? So I tell you this story to ask you. Tell us about some of Joe's loses because I know you mentioned that 48-unit but we've all done enough deals to where we're going to have some loses. I think that's important for people to understand as well, don't you?

Joe: Absolutely. I completely agree. For me, at that point, I bought that building in 2009, I was already in the business for over 10 years and I want to go which was I was told to the next level. In order to do that, everyone tells me you need to go multifamily. Go big! Go big!

Larry: Right.

Joe: So what I actually did was I bought a 7-unit building over on the eastside of Cleveland and it didn’t work. Make the long story short, it didn’t work. I can to go through those numbers with you if you really want you, but it didn’t work. So I went back to my peer groups. Why is it not working? And they said to me, “well, you didn’t buy big enough. Seven units is not big enough.” I go, okay, and I go and buy 48-units right across street from the seven suiter. Exact same thing. It didn’t work. I was losing money. I mean, just quick numbers. I was into that building for about 21,000 a unit.

Larry: Right.

Joe: The rent was 450 a door, but I was paying water. I was paying for heat. I was paying for common area lighting and maintenance and all that. When you start to break that down, that 450 a month per door disappears quick.

Larry: It does, don’t it?

Joe: It’s amazing. If you start budgeting for CapEx that you’re going to have for a roof, and a parking lot and boilers, there’s just no money in it really.

Larry: Yeah.

Joe: Debt service? Oh my goodness. I fought with that building for over 10 years trying to make that thing run. It did. I didn’t lose monthly or anything. It just broke even, you know, away we go. Finally, I just figured that I’ve got to get out of this and it’s not going to work for me and it was it. I sold it.

Larry: Sometimes, you get to the point to where your time is more valuable. I mean, you were breakeven on the cash flow and even if you got to take a small loss, you’re better off just to move on so you don’t have to deal with it anymore.

Joe: Well you’re right. Actually, from the sale to the sale price, I lost $50,000.

Larry: Right.

Joe: It wasn’t a lot. It was a hell of an education. I went from a high school education in multifamily to a PHD in multifamily. That was it. It wasn’t for me. It didn’t work. I’ve never lost on a single family home. If something didn’t work out and the rehab is more than I thought, it’s just time. Just give it a little more time. It’s get your money back.

Larry: Right.

Joe: It didn’t happen with this multifamily. The more time was the more money I put into that building.

Larry: Yeah. You know, there’s one thing I’ve always said with multifamily. You only have one kind of buyer. That’s an investor.

Joe: Exactly.

Larry: With a single family, you know, it could be a fix and flip investor, a landlord, a rent to own tenant, or you know an owner occupied tenant or person who’s going to pay cash.

Joe: Yes. You’re right. Here’s the great line for that building. Because I had a little bit of tough time selling that building and the feedback was 48 units is too big for the small guys and too small for the big guys.

Larry: Wow.

Joe: So 48 unit is kind of a weird spot to be in. I get it.

Larry: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. That makes sense. Talk a little bit about, you mentioned Section 8 earlier. Some people may or may not understand Section 8. Explain that a little bit if you don’t mind.

Joe: So, Section 8 is a government-funded subsidy for people who are low income, you know maybe single moms or people that need to get on their feet. So there’s this program they call Section 8. It’s very hard to get on this program, at least in my city here.

Larry: This probably have a waiting list.

Joe: Oh, huge waiting list. I want to say, let me try to give you some numbers, don’t hold me to these numbers, but there’s approximately 10,000 new vouchers a year that are given, and there’s 30,000-40,000 applicants a year for the program. So, when people get, they go into a lottery and when they actually pull these golden tickets, and it really is because you’re rent is paid, they’re usually a very grateful group of people. My Section 8 tenants are some of the most grateful and respectful tenants I have in my portfolio.

Larry: Wow.

Joe: It really is. It’s a wonderful program. Section 8 typically tends to pay a little bit more, about 20% more than market rent we’ve seen here because there’s a huge need for it and they’re trying to get independent landlords on board. Here it’s called CMHA. A lot of CMHA, they have their own properties, public housing they own, but they also have the housing choice voucher program and that’s what it is. The housing choice voucher gives the tenant the opportunity to pick any house they want to if a landlord will offer Section 8 to them. Not a lot of landlords really do it here and when I put a house up for Section 8 rental online, you know listed, oh my gosh, Larry. I can get 40 phone calls a day every day.

Larry: Wow.

Joe: It’s that insane. It’s a dog fight for these things here.

Larry: That’s crazy, isn’t it?

Joe: It’s crazy. It’s crazy. Those example I gave of a $75,000 home getting 800 to 850 in rent, that’s on a private pay. Section 8 would pay 1,050 to 1,100 for that house.

Larry: Wow. That’s really good.

Joe: It’s really good so there are two ways to do something like that, you know.

Larry: I remember a time in Charlotte when Section 8, when there was a lot of people with vouchers, right? I remember a time when people would call up and you will start telling them about the house, they were being selective, right? They were like, do you have a pool? Do you have a sunroom? I need a double garage, right?

Joe: Oh my goodness. Unbelievable.


Larry: That’s crazy, right?

Joe: It is. It is crazy.

Larry: That is good. Now, Section 8 where you are, do they pay the entire rent or is it based on their income and maybe the tenant has to pay a small portion?

Joe: Yeah, it’s really based on the tenant. Some are fully subsidized and some have to pay a portion of the rent each month and it’s just case by case, if ever tenant works or doesn’t work. You know, Section 8 is really a rehabilitation program. It’s a program that take people in, get them back on their feet, get them working, and get them off on their own. Sometimes, they have to pay a portion.

Larry: Yeah. That’s good. So, Joe, if anybody wants to reach out to you, maybe they’re interested in buying one of these turnkey properties through the bank of Joe or maybe buying some of these notes that are double digit, high yield notes, or you know, whatever. How would somebody reach out to you?

Joe: You can drop me an email. It’s the same email I had for years. It’s R-E-Broker the number is 2-1-6 at gmail.com or just call my office. I don’t hide behind any admins or anything. You can reach me right here at area code 440-387-4800 and I’m at extension 2.

Larry: There you go. That’s good. You have a realty company too. So you have people managing that. You got people dealing with the real estate. You kind of hang out every day. You don’t have a lot going on that you have to do, do you?

Joe: Larry, you’re my last thing of the day right now. I’m going back home. The kids are on summer vacation. I’m going to go do something fun with them. That is it.

Larry: That’s awesome. That’s really good. How old are your kids?

Joe: Five and seven. I have little ones.

Larry: Five and seven. Wow. Yeah, you got young ones. I’ve got a 21-year-old daughter. She has two kids, one is two and one is a few months old. Then, I have a 13-year-old son.

Joe: Oh my goodness. Yeah, you’re on the other side of the fence here. I’m still trying to get my 5-year-old to let go of her pants. It makes me crazy.

Larry: I hear you. That’s funny. Oh man, I really appreciate you being on today. This has been awesome.

Joe: Oh thanks, Larry. I really appreciate you having me on.

Larry: Let me know if there’s anything at all that I can do for you, man. I appreciate you, and you keep doing what you’re doing and helping those people become homeowners and helping investors create wealth.

Joe: Thank you, sir. I’ll see you soon.

Larry: Awesome, man. Thanks a lot. See you at the next CG.

Joe: You got it, buddy. For sure.

Larry: Take care.