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All about Land Flipping with Jack Bosch
Jack Bosch also known as "The Land Guy,” is an experienced business owner, entrepreneur, real estate investor, respected industry leader, speaker, and educator. He's also the author of the bestselling financial literacy book "Forever Cash" and the creator of the Land Profit Generator Real Estate Without Hassles System.
With his Land For Pennies investment method, Jack and Michelle went from zero to a million in just 18 months and from there built a real estate investment empire that spans multiple areas of real estate including land flipping, financing/notes, tax delinquent real estate, home rentals, commercial, multi-family investments, and education.
- Who Jack Bosch is
- How he got into real estate
- Discovering land flipping
- A typical land deal that he does
- Installment sales versus dealer status
- Finding land deals
- List of criteria they look for
- Market on recreational properties
- How they market the properties to sell
- Landlocked properties
RESOURCES AND LINKS FROM THIS SHOW:
- Facebook Marketplace
- Land Profit Generator
- The Forever Cash Life Real Estate Investing Podcast by Jack and Michelle Bosch
- Larry Goins Partner Program Application
Larry: Welcome to the Brain Pick-A-Pro Show, live from Lake Wylie, South Carolina. I’m Larry Goins. Thank you, guys, so much for watching. As you know, every week, we interview a different rock star in real estate, and it’s people I know I can trust, and that’s the only people I like to have on, and I’ve been in this business for about thirty years, been teaching over fifteen years, so I’ve met a lot of people, and I know who I need to have on this show that you can get some really, really, really good content and value from, and today it’s my good, long-time friend. This guy is an auction expert, he’s a land expert, he’s a passive income expert, he’s a world traveler, he’s a good friend of mine, and I just love him to death. Please give a warm welcome, Jack Bosch. What’s going on, buddy?
Jack: Hey, how are you, Larry? I’m excited to be here. Lots of stuff going on. Really, life is good.
Larry: I know. Before we started recording, you and I were talking a little bit about it. You know, as we get older, we wanna do things a little bit different and change a little bit and make it more about lifestyle than just out there grinding all the time, so, yeah, I’m glad that you’re able to do that and myself as well, and why don’t you start out and tell our viewers and listeners a little bit about yourself?
Jack: Alright, I’ll be happy to. So, first of all, you can tell from my accent that I’m not from North Carolina, South Carolina, or anywhere out there. I’m from Germany originally, so I’m an immigrant to the US. I came over here in 1997 to finish my college degree and I’ve been in real estate now for sixteen years. It’s the end of – really, for like almost twenty years, nineteen years, but successfully in real estate for sixteen years. So, it took us – I spent the first few years having a job here, dabbling in real estate, trying to figure out how this all works and finally discovered a method of real estate investing that really very, very, very few people are doing which basically is real estate without houses. In essence, I stumbled upon land flipping. I realized that you can flip land, you can do everything in land that you can do in houses. You can flip it, you can wholesale it, you can develop it, you can build something on it, you can split it, you can sell it, very important, you can sell it for seller financing and create cash flow from land without even being subject to like Dodd-Frank and those kind of stuff, and all the best thing of that is you can do it all without having to deal with houses, so no inspections, no roof repairs, no foundation repairs, no mortgages, no contractors, no tenants, toilets, termites, none of that kind of stuff. So, me as coming to the US as a beginning investor, as really having no idea about real estate whatsoever, that was a gift from heaven because I didn’t have to learn all these – it was hard enough to start learning the real estate terminology and learning how the rules even work in the US and I didn’t have to learn on top of it all the terminology and all the things about house flipping and house repairing and all those things having to do with houses. So – ’cause in land, there’s no houses on it, right? And then the method we figured out on top of it allows us to get these properties for like 10 cents on the dollar, so it was a way to – so, I came in to the country, I got my degree, I got a job, I didn’t like my job, and we wanted to figure something else out, and land flipping really was the easiest way that we could’ve ever gotten into real estate and continuously.
Larry: That is awesome, man. That’s awesome. I love it because, you know, just by default, I do some of your strategy, and I’ll mention one of those deals here in a little bit, but tell us what is a typical type of a land deal that you do, Jack?
Jack: So, a typical kind of land deal is a deal where we go and pick up a piece of land, perhaps, usually in the outskirts of town, that’s where like most of our deals come from. Like, basically, there is a big city and right where that big city ends, right? Right where it ends is what we call the path of growth, right, because the city keeps growing, economy’s in a boom, cities are expanding again. Well, if you go out, just as I said, a few miles outside of where the city ends, you are in an area that is desirable because the city’s gonna eventually get there and you’re also in an area that is much lower cost than in the city, so an acre in the city might be worth $300,000. An acre five miles outside of town, outside of the border of the town where the city ends might only be worth $40,000, so that’s kind of our most favorite deal because you get this kind of $30,000, $40,000 property and what we specialize in is finding the people who no longer wants those which is actually land, there’s actually more people out there like that than in houses. So, we find those deals and then we only pay between 5 and 25 cents on the dollar for those deals, so we basically get a deal on the high end like that, let’s say it’s worth $40,000. On the high end, we pay $9,000 or $10,000 for it, so let’s just say $8,000 would be a good offer on that deal, so we get a $40,000 deal for $8,000 under contract and then we go flip it like you would flip a house. We go flip it for $20,000, make $12,000 profit, or we go and flip it for $40,000, full market price, or perhaps a slight discount, $35,000, and then ask them to give us like a 20 percent down payment, like a $7,000, $8,000 down payment, and then get monthly payments and then do seller financing. The beauty of that is that, with the down payment, you almost or often entirely get, with the money that you pay for the property back, so we pay date, we got $7,000 or $8,000 down payment, well, that’s about pretty much what we paid for it, so now we have nothing in the deal and we get monthly payments on the deal, so this is our two ways of doing deals like that and we do them all from about $10,000 through $100,000 is the kind of value of the properties we focus on.
Larry: That’s awesome, man. I love it, I love it. I have three land deals going on right now, actually. We’ve got about twenty-eight houses under contract in our pipeline. Three of them are land deals.
Larry: Yeah. I typically tell people when I’m on the phone with somebody, and we buy all of our stuff over the phone, and we say, look, you know, with this little infill – I call ’em infill lots, it’s just a lot where there’s a bunch of thirty-, forty-, fifty-year-old houses around it. Nobody’s gonna wanna buy that lot and build a house on, that’s what I tell ’em, right? Because who wants to have a brand-new house in 2018 right next to a house that was built in the thirties, right?
Larry: So, typically, all we can pay you is around two to three years’ worth of your tax bill, so if your taxes are $200 a year, we’ll give you $600 for the lot. In fact, I’m buying two lots right now side by side, I’m paying $1,200 for both of them.
Jack: There we go. That’s exactly what you do, and as I said, I gave you a high-end example, you take a property worth $20,000, there’s plenty of us, including us and our students, that get a deal like that for under $2,000.
Larry: Yeah, exactly.
Jack: So – and then what do you do? You sell – that’s your second way, with infill lots. We love those streets full of houses, an empty lot, depending on the value of those houses, it is actually feasible to build a house on there.
Larry: Right, right.
Jack: Or you can also sell, simply sell it to the neighbor for like $10,000 because the neighbor wants to – actually, he’s gotten used to nobody being next to him. They like that nobody’s next to him. They wanna keep it that way so they’ll buy the lot from you and, just to expand their backyard and to keep the neighbor – keep a house from being built there and then, whether cash or seller financing, if you pay $600 for that thing, I mean, you can sell it for $10,000 with a $1,000 down payment and $200 a month or $250 a month for the next five years.
Larry: Exactly, exactly. And one thing, one very, very, very important thing you mentioned a few minutes ago was you don’t have to worry about Dodd-Frank ’cause many people watching this, you know, about my training, Filthy Riches, I buy these little cheap houses for $5,000 or $10,000 and seller finance ’em for $30,000, $40,000, $50,000. You don’t have to worry about that with your land deals, do you, Jack?
Jack: No, you don’t, because Dodd-Frank was designed for – under the – I think it’s regulation Z or something like that called. It applies only to what’s called dwellings, and a dwelling is a residential structure from one to four units. It does, I understand, include fixed mobile homes but it does not include land because land is not a dwelling, right? So, land is just land, so it doesn’t fall into that category, and also there’s an IRS loophole that doesn’t fall into what’s called the dealer status either, and actually in the housing world, you’re subject to the dealer status if you flip a lot of houses.
Larry: Wait a minute, tell us about that because I had a huge tax bill a few years ago for –
Jack: I bet.
Larry: Yeah, a few years ago, I’m like, man, because my accountant wouldn’t let me take the installment sale ’cause I did so many of ’em.
Jack: Exactly right. Yeah, so the dealer status basically says that if you’re flipping a piece of land and – the dealer status says if you’re flipping real estate and you’re doing seller financing and then if you’re a dealer – a dealer is somebody who just flips a lot of properties so you’re a dealer, Larry, I’m a dealer, there’s no way around it, if you do a lot of real estate deals, you’re a dealer, but if you’re flipping houses and you do this installment sale method and let’s just say you buy a property for $600 and you go sell it for $20,000 and you’re getting now a, let’s say, a $600 down payment, so you’ve really not made any money on this deal yet but what they’re saying is if you’re subject to the dealer – if you’re a dealer, you cannot use the installment sale method, so in other words, what they’re saying is, well, you made a – he’s bought it for $600, sold for $20,000, you made a $19,400 profit on that deal and whether or not you receive the money today, you gotta pay us taxes on it today. And that’s why your tax bill was so high because your CPA wouldn’t allow you to basically pay only taxes on the money that you’ve received. Well, there’s a loophole for land that basically says that if you buy a piece of land and you sell it and you don’t materially change it in the middle, so you don’t build something on it, you don’t change its zoning, you don’t do things like that, but you just basically flip it, right? And that’s what we’re doing. Four thousand times we have done this already in the last sixteen years. We flipped four thousand properties, four thousand pieces of land, so when you do that, you’re exempt from the dealer status. In other words, in this case, if you buy this property for $600, sell it for $20,000 and you get, let’s say $300 a month in cash flow from that deal or $400 a month in cash flow, after one year, you’ll receive $4,800. Well, you only pay taxes on the profit portion of the $4,800 after subtracting your regular business expenses so anything that you can legally write off, you write off against it, and then let’s say you might have left over now $1,500, so you pay taxes on $1,500 a year, not on the full $19,000 that you haven’t even received. That’s obviously a game changer because in the first case, when you have to perhaps send out $6,000 to the IRS that you did not receive yet, in this [inaudible 0:11:35] pay taxes on $1,500 which you have received so it’s a much easier kind of scenario.
Larry: That’s huge. You know what, Jack, I never knew there was a loophole for the installment sale versus dealer status for land. I never knew that.
Jack: That – and nobody ever knows that. I talked to some of the top CPAs in the country, they didn’t know that but my CPA ended up finding it somewhere, dug in to some provision from the 1980s that the builders, where there was a crash in real estate, that the builders were tied up with a lot of land and they got congress to insert that kind of sentence somewhere in the tax code and nobody has ever challenged it ever since.
Larry: That’s great, man. That’s huge. So, tell us a little bit about – how do you go about finding these land deals?
Jack: So, we do direct mail like everyone else does with the difference that our direct mail gets a huge response rate, so here’s the situation on the response rate so we’re – like houses have an inherent value in themselves that you can take and you can rent it even if it’s so hard to rent it orsell it, even if through a handyman.
Jack: Somebody’s gonna be willing to take that property and make it livable and then go live in it. In land, you can’t really live on it so what happened is people bought it twenty, thirty, forty, fifty years ago as a financial investment in many cases ’cause they’re expecting the value to go up and depending it could have been that they bought it just on the outskirts of town but the city grew this way instead of that way and it’s just now starting to grow this way. So, basically, because of that – so the city grew east instead of west and their property is on the west side of town, so, because of that, their property might have never gone up a lot in value but it’s still not worthless, it’s worth $20,000 or $30,000 or something like that since the city might be now growing westwards so it’s in the path of growth, but to them they’re like, “You know what, I’ve had it for thirty years, I don’t want it anymore. I’ve been paying property taxes off for thirty years,” that’s a big one. They don’t like paying property taxes on this because land, when you hold on to it, doesn’t have cash flow.
Jack: So, however, who in the world therefore would wanna own such a piece of land? Right? Well, it’s people that, first of all, if it’s in the outskirts of town, it’s people that wanna go and live a little bit more rural but be close to the city. Also, people that perhaps are close to retirement but unfortunately don’t have much money to retire. So, they’re able to buy these lots from us right now with a – as we just said, a $30,000 lot that we bought for $4,000, they give us a $4,000 down payment and $300 a month. They have that kind of money. They pay it off over the next ten years, then they go put the mobile home on it or build a small house on it and now they have pretty much a free and clear lot with a free and clear property, a mobile home on it, and they live a dignified retirement, right? So, people like doing that and – or it’s financial investors that buy these properties that now, “See, hey, the city is growing westwards so let me go ahead, outside of the city, let me put some of the money out of the stock market, pull it out of the stock market, put it in there,” so they buy these properties, hold on to them and when the city does approach, they’re very successful, they’re making a ton of money and a lot of our customers have made a ton of money right now in the market run-up, so there’s lots of people that want these properties but there’s also lots of people, even more than in the households we’re finding, that are willing to let them go because they’re sick and tired of paying these property taxes. They have inherited them or all those kind of reasons, so what we do is we send them a direct mail, so we figure out who they are, we have a list of criteria and a priority list of who we go after first, second, third, fourth, and so on, and then we find those people that have bought these properties thirty, forty years ago that live out of state, they don’t care about these properties, in many case, they inherited them even from their parents and they don’t want to pay the property taxes, they don’t wanna care about these properties, they don’t wanna keep paying for clean-up fees and stuff like that, like mowing the grass and stuff like that. They don’t wanna do that, particularly if it’s an infill lot, so they just wanna get out, so when we send out the direct mail piece, we have a very specific direct mail piece that we’ve developed over years and years. They literally get us, in many cases, a 10 plus percent response rate on our letter.
Larry: Wow, that’s huge.
Jack: That is huge. Yeah, I know.
Larry: That’s huge, 10 percent. Listen, when you’re doing direct mail for houses, if you’re getting a 10 percent response rate, it’s because you’re getting a lot of hate calls, right?
Jack: Yeah. No, we barely get any hate calls. We get literally just people saying like, “Hey, yes, I’ve owned this thing for fifty years and you wanna have it?” And we even get properties for free. Well, not very often but about once a year we get a deal for free.
Larry: That’s pretty cool. They’re just tired of paying the taxes.
Jack: They’re just tired of paying the taxes. They kind of don’t see that – in their mind, the property hasn’t gone much up in value, they’re just tired of it, they give it to their kids, the kids live in New York City, the property is in Texas and they’re just, “Yeah, I’m never gonna go out there. My dad bought something back while we’re driving through there,” or something or [inaudible 0:16:53] and now who do we sell them? We sell them to the people I mentioned, or if it’s a more rural land, we just sold 40 acres to somebody who just wants to ATV, camp.
Jack: Who doesn’t wanna have a ranch or 40 acres, right? I mean, lots of people want that [inaudible 0:17:08] camp or get RV out there, build a cabin and things like that, and because we can make it affordable either by a wholesale price or with seller financing, we got a – they often sell very quickly.
Larry: That’s awesome, man. I love it, I love it. We just bought 8 acres for $10,000 and that was a steal, that was a steal, so I know exactly what you’re talking about. I had a guy on the phone the other day and we got to talk and he said, “I bought this years ago, years and years and years ago,” and he said, “I bought it online.” He said, “I’ve never been there, never seen it,” and he said, “I only think about it one time a year.” You know when that is, right?
Jack: When the tax bill comes.
Larry: When the tax bill comes, right? That’s exactly – Jack, can you give us any of that list criteria that you guys look for?
Jack: Yeah. So, basically, we’re looking for properties between $10,000 and $100,000, that’s our sweet spot. Now, the numbers change. You can go above that, but the numbers change in terms of what we offer. We find that very few people are willing to take a $10,000 offer for a $200,000 property.
Jack: Right, so when it’s a property worth $200,000, you got to go offer 40, 30, 40, 50 percent of market value but then you can go flip it for 60, 70 percent of market value and still make $20,000 on it, right? So, it’s still a good deal in that case, and we just had one of our students buy a property for, was it like, $28,000 and go flip it for $86,000. That’s a good deal. We bought properties for $1,800 and sold them for $86,000, also it happened to be the same amount, but this is stuff that happens also, but, usually, the moment you go above a hundred, you got to up your percentages that you offer. Then, we offer – we like people – obviously, I mean it’s common things. It’s like people that live out of state we love, but it doesn’t mean that the in-state people won’t accept your offer, just they want usually a little bit more money because they know the market a little bit better and they are able to drive out there themselves, put a sign, “For sale by owner” sign on there and sell it themselves, so in order to buy these deals from in-state people, you need to usually offer a little bit more money. Then, if we have availability too, if we can access that information, we look at when does the last deed exchange happen, when did the last change of owner happen? We like properties that have been owned for a longer time because it usually speaks – if they haven’t done anything with the property for twenty-five years, then chances are they really don’t – they’re just holding on to it because they don’t know what else to do with it, right?
Jack: That’s part of it and there’s a couple of other things that we look at like the size of the property plays a role. For example, if you go into the rural areas, you do not want to deal with itty-bitty tiny properties. So like if you’re like really in rural America where people have 40-acre ranches, 80-acre ranches, or even 8- or 10-acre properties which is enough to have, I mean, that’s eight football fields. You look at – you imagine Sunday Night Football and you look at a football field and you imagine eight of those next to each other, that’s a lot of land, right?
Jack: And even that thing is a nice size for somebody to have a – put a house on that, have some horses on there, or something like that. But nobody’s gonna want the quarter acre in those rural areas.
Jack: A quarter acre is like just enough to put a house on there and have a little backyard, and if you’re in the rural areas, you want 5 acres minimum, so when we are in the rural acres, just from a selling point of view, like you can get quarter acres in the rural areas but you’re gonna have a hard time selling them, and what I teach, what we teach our students, we teach this now just like you teach your methods, so our students, what we teach them is in the rural areas, go with 5 acres plus. If you can, even 10 acres plus, because you’re gonna get a ton of deals, but also on the selling side, it’s much, much easier to sell ’em because they are way more attractive than a quarter-acre property somewhere out there.
Larry: That’s a really good point, and you know, Jack, there’s a huge market, especially right now, for recreational property. Can you –
Jack: Oh, yeah, big time.
Larry: Can you tell us something else?
Jack: Yeah, there’s recreational. I mean, people have money, first of all, and when people have money, they wanna go do fun stuff, and they – so there’s this huge, multi, multibillion industry for RVs, for ATVs, for dirt bikes, for camping, for all those kind of stuff, so there’s a huge market for that and obviously we’re tapping into that because do people really wanna stay with their RV in an RV park? Where, I mean, those RV walls are small, are thin, right? If the neighbor in the next RV over watches TV, you can’t sleep at night, right?
Larry: Right, right.
Jack: You get an RV, it’s because you wanna put it out there somewhere and ideally not wildly put it out there but put it on the old piece of land, put a fence around there. That’s one way. The other way is that people like – they like to have a place on their own somewhere out there so they like to put a cabin out there. Some of our buyers, they end up buying cabins or mobile homes out there and they have a place to go out to in the weekend. Then thirdly, it’s also there’s the Doomsday prepper crowd, right? The Doomsday preppers, they’re thinking, they’re worried about the debt of the country, they’re worried about the different things that’s going on about North Korea and things like that so they basically wanna have a place that they can [inaudible 0:22:21] that is ideally even off the grid. So, people always ask me, “Jack, what if this area, they have no electricity, they have no running water to ’em, can you even sell those?” It’s like, yeah, you can, because there’s an entire movement towards the tiny homes. There’s an entire movement towards solar. Solar is more efficient now that people, they dig a well, they drill a well, they get solar, and they are completely off the grid and have the ability to basically stay there if an emergency situation comes up, and while I don’t necessarily am a prepper, I don’t really think we’re gonna have a situation like that, still I respect it and I happily sell them properties at good deals.
Larry: That’s really good, man. I love that. There is a huge demand for recreational property, especially right now, and everybody wants to go have their own spot, right? And like you said, the Doomsday preppers too, the preppers, they wanna have a place to go put their bunker, right?
Jack: Exactly. They wanna put a bunker in 10 acres, then go ahead. They can do whatever they want on those properties.
Larry: That’s really good. That’s good. So, share with us a little bit about selling the property. How do you market these properties to sell?
Jack: Right. So, we sell ’em by, again, by seller financing or wholesaling so the way we sell ’em, like the method we sell ’em or the offer we make is either a [inaudible 0:23:44] price seller cash offer ’cause we buy it at 20 cents, can we sell it at 50 cents on the dollar? A 100 percent, right? Or it’s a closer to market value seller financing offer. If you think about it [inaudible 0:23:58] any house out there, most of the houses sell at 10 percent down and the 90 percent loan from the bank. The only thing here is that, in this case, lenders, banks don’t like to lend on land, so, as a result, they don’t give a loan on these and there’s no public market for these loans, so therefore they’re – if they don’t have the money, they’re usually stuck there by not being able to buy the property. Well, in our case –
Larry: It helps you, actually.
Jack: That helps us, exactly, because now we can go, we can offer seller financing, and just like in the housing world, we don’t have to actually sell the houses – we don’t have discount the houses, we don’t have to discount the land here either by selling it with seller financing, so now how do we go about actually selling ’em as we are doing this online. We’re just going basically on platforms like Zillow, we can list our properties on Zillow. We list our properties on landwatch.com. We list our properties on Craigslist, on Redfin [inaudible 0:24:56] If you have access to the MLS in your market, you can list it in the MLS in your market. Anywhere else where other people also list their properties, and then obviously, over time, if you build up your website, you can list it on your website, but even that’s cool, the first couple of deals, you don’t need your own website, you can just go on [inaudible 0:25:13] kind of places. Facebook Marketplace is a huge place right now.
Larry: It really is. We generate a ton of leads on Facebook right now. All of the local groups, the local groups where we’re selling property as well as Facebook Marketplace and you mentioned LandWatch too. LandWatch is a big one, isn’t it?
Jack: Yes. LandWatch is huge. LandWatch is kind of like the 800-pound gorilla of the land market, like there’s like several hundred thousand properties being listed there on LandWatch in every county of the entire United States [inaudible 0:25:47] if that county is a good county because if you see like, in a specific county that there’s five thousand lots for sale at $3,000 a property, yeah, that’s not necessarily the county you wanna go into because we don’t – we’re not bottom feeding here. We’re looking for quality, good property, so you can look around in LandWatch, you can see, if you see that there’s only a few hundred properties listed and the majority of them is listed at $10,000 to $100,000, well, that’s your kind of county, right? And if you see that there’s some sales results on Zillow and on the MLS that these areas have sold, then that’s your kind of county, right? So, that’s how we go. So we really go very systematically at this, not just like randomly crazy because, the truth is, because it’s land, you can do this anywhere – from anywhere in the world. We literally have like about a dozen German students right now from Germany that do this in the United States, and one of them particularly has done like thirty-five deals already, he’s never physically actually been in the United States himself.
Larry: Jack, I love it, man. I love it. Real estate investing from around the world.
Jack: Yeah, because it’s land. I mean, what are you gonna go look at? Actually, I saw your Facebook post the other day, Larry, where you got stuck by looking at land. I was – I felt bad for you so I didn’t post anything but I wanted to go [inaudible 0:27:11] what are you doing in the first place looking at the land in person? Like Google Earth and Google Maps is enough. You don’t have to go out there and the county website, you can see anything you can see you need to see on that property. I haven’t gone out to see any of my properties in twelve years.
Larry: That’s awesome, that’s awesome. I love it. Yeah, you got a right to bust my chops. The only reason I went to look at it was I was gonna keep it for myself, right? And it wasn’t too far away.
Jack: I figured there was a reason [inaudible 0:27:42] like because we did the same thing, we never got stuck but we almost got stuck. I mean, the first few years, we went and look at these properties and with our SUV, we were like literally driving on three wheels and one was up in the air and stuff like that, and at some point in time, we’re like, “Why are we doing this? Why are we looking at these properties?”
Jack: Everything we want to see on the county GIS website, the geographic information website, or on Google Earth or on Google Maps. There’s no reason in the world you actually need to go out there. Now, we don’t go out there. Nobody in our team goes out there, and literally most of our students don’t go out there. I mean, I got a student that’s been doing this for ten years, she has never seen a single one of her properties.
Larry: That’s awesome, that’s awesome. I wanna ask you a question. Do you ever run into property that somebody’s wanting to sell that may be landlocked and –
Larry: What do you do about that? Because we run into that quite often.
Jack: Yeah. On landlocked property, properties, it depends how badly it’s landlocked. What I mean by that is, like let’s say if the road is here and the property is just one property away from the road, then the first thing we’ll do is we’ll go contact the guy that has the road access and ask him – and see if he wants to buy the property, and in many cases, they’ll buy it right there because they can double the size and then the landlocked problem is removed because now it has a continuous property with the bottom being accessible to the road. Also, we also look at what would the property – first of all, we subtract the value for the property. If the property regularly would be worth $50,000, the fact that it’s landlocked in our mind reduces the value by at least 50 percent.
Jack: So, basically, we’d put it down to $20,000, $25,000, and then we’ll go – we market it as an opportunity in that sense, ’cause the opportunity is that – the reality is that in the United States, by law, nobody could prevent you from accessing your property. So, what it means is that you would have to go and ask the neighbor for an easement. And if the neighbor is nice, then the neighbor is gonna get you the easement and everything is fine, letter threaten – have a survey done, have a title company write up the – or have the surveyor write up the legal description for the easement, have the seller sign that easement and it’s done and you have access to the property. If it’s the seller, if the neighbor is not friendly, then you might have to sue ’em to get an easement, but the law will always prevail and will allow you some access, an access to the property. The judge will have to just decide which is the best access to that property. So, what we do is we do none of that. We don’t get our own easements, we don’t go through that process, but we basically sell it either to the neighbor or we sell it as an opportunity by basically saying, listen, we are wholesalers, right? We’re just gonna flip this property as is, but here’s an opportunity. This property, as is, is worth $20,000. Once you get the easement, it’s worth $50,000. So, if you’re willing to put in the work and get the easement, you can unlock $30,000 off this deal. So – and then, now that becomes an opportunity for somebody and, with that, we sell it fairly quickly because there’s always gonna be somebody that says like, “Well, I can do that. I can go through that process, and unlock $30,000 for like a few days of work. That’s a no-brainer,” so they go do that and we make our money because if it’s worth only $20,000 in this case, we’ll go pick it up for $2,000 or $3,000, we’ll go sell it to him for $18,000 or so, or $20,000 with seller financing, they’ll go out, the buyer, he’ll go out, get the easement on it, make a $50,000 property out of it, and everyone is happy in the process.
Larry: That’s good, man. I love it. I really appreciate you taking the time to share that. That was really good because we do run into that, and I know you have a lot of students that run into that too, to know how to handle that. Do you sell many of your properties with seller financing on eBay? We do a lot of that, and they would bid for the down payment.
Jack: Yes, yes. Not that much anymore. So, we still sell a lot of property with seller financing. We love seller financing. I love cash flow. I mean, at the end of the day, that’s what we are doing. Like we’re flipping land for cash and cash flow and then we’re taking that cash and cash flow and rolling it over into other asset classes to just hold on, that’s why we buy apartment complexes right now in addition to the land flipping, just to hold on to what we call forever cash, right? Forever cash flow, cash that lasts forever, and so, when we sell these lots, we either get cash or we get cash flow, when we sell ’em, and I love the fact that when we sell ’em with seller financing, because we have so little money in the deal, even if we don’t get all the money as a down payment, within a year, we get all our money back.
Jack: Yes, so we love cash flow. We probably sell 80 percent of our deals with seller financing. Now, our students right now, everyone decides on their own. I got students that have – have done a hundred deals, have never done seller financing, ’cause they just want the cash. They need the cash. They might have to get out of debt. They might have to pay off student debt. They might have to pay credit card debt. They might have to pay – wanna pay off their house, and so, one of our students, in a year and a half, he’d paid off his condo, paid off his cars, completely debt free, right? So, on the seller financing side, we love doing that, but do we use eBay? Not so much anymore. eBay is really not as good as it used to be –
Larry: I thought so too.
Jack: We do sell some of our cheapo properties on eBay occasionally, so some of the deals, what will happen when you do this is you find the deal that’s worth $50,000 that you get under contract for $8,000 and then you sell it for $30,000, right? You make a good $22,000 in profit. But perhaps that owner often owns another three properties, they’re only worth $5,000, and in order to get the $50,000 property, you gotta pick up the $5,000 properties too but you pay him like $100 apiece.
Jack: They just wanna get rid of them, so now you pay $8,000 for this one, but you pay $8,300 and you get all four properties.
Jack: Now, these other three properties, they’re only worth $5,000, I don’t wanna put much effort in them, so I literally put them on eBay for like $3,900 with a $1 down payment and the bidding is on – and a $300 fee or so, and then if the down payment ends up at $25, they end up putting $325 down and they start making monthly payments. And that kind of deal still works on eBay.
Jack: And it’s easy to do and it’s simple to do, or sometimes I might just put ’em up on eBay for $1,000 cash, just sell ’em, get rid of ’em, and I make $900 on the deal, but I just don’t have to mess with them for much longer, right? So – these kinds of deals work on eBay but the big, more expensive deals, they currently and for very several years have not worked on eBay very well.
Larry: That’s really good. I’m glad you shared that. I haven’t put a property on eBay in several years ’cause I kinda noticed the same thing, but I just wanted to get your opinion about that as well.
Jack: Yeah. We used to sell – we sold over three hundred properties on eBay, but then it started just changing and stuff.
Larry: Yeah. That’s good. I think Facebook is really what’s hot right now.
Jack: Facebook, and within Facebook, Facebook Marketplace is hot right now.
Jack: So, you put something up on Facebook Marketplace and if you do it the right way, which we’re just adding a module to our course on how to do it the right way, literally your inbox, your message inbox blows up. Some of our properties we put out there, we’re getting like fifty responses in like a couple of days. And, yes, a lot of them are tire pickers, so you gotta deal with ’em, but then we have a method to actually identify the tire pickers, separate the tire pickers from the serious people.
Larry: That’s good. You gotta do that. We get a couple hundred messages a week on Facebook.
Larry: And it’s hard to keep up with them.
Jack: Right. You’d almost – at that point, but if you’re at that level, I mean, that’s a good problem to have. That’s a luxury problem to have, right.
Larry: That’s true. Man, Jack, I really, really appreciate you being on. This has been some great stuff. If somebody wanted to learn more about land deals and about yourself, how would they connect with you?
Jack: Well, they can simply go – we have a Facebook group called Forever Cash, Land for Pennies, and basically because, again, we’re talking, a lot of our successful students are in there, and then you can also go obviously to our website which is landprofitgenerator.com and check us out there and, again, but on Facebook, we built this group of people that are – a lot of our students hang out there and they’re super successful and so there’s a lot of exchange of how things work and then people just helping each other from there in a giving way to succeed in the business.
Larry: That’s awesome, man. Thank you so much for everything you shared, and, guys, go check out Jack, check out his website and connect with him. He’s a good guy. He’s got a good education business and he’s a real real estate investor, just a great guy, great family man, and I think the world of him. That’s why he’s on here.
Jack: I forgot one thing. I also have a podcast, by the way. It’s called the Forever Cash Life Podcast, so it’s all about forever cash, at the end of the day, so I forgot that. And, actually, Michelle, you know her too, she’s come up with her own podcast too, so if you search Michelle Bosch or Jack Bosch, you’ll find both of our podcasts too.
Larry: That’s great –
Jack: Sorry, didn’t mean to –
Larry: No, no, no. That’s great. It’s good stuff. It’s good stuff. So, guys, thank you so much for watching this. Thanks, Jack, for being on. And, guys, be sure and share this. If you’re on Facebook, be sure and share it, or write us a review, give us a review if you’re on iTunes or whatever, and we really appreciate you guys watching this. Thank you so much. And if we can ever help you with anything, please be sure and reach out with us. We do have a partner program where we partner with people. You can go to larrygoins.com/apply to apply to work with us in our partner program or you can come right here to my office to spend a few days with me so thanks again, Jack. I really appreciate that. Thanks a lot everybody. See you next week.